Boys and Girls in Games

[Scarecrow]

Article link.

The above article appeared on my Facebook today, and I clicked it expecting the usual sort of material that some of my friends love posting to do with gender equality. Instead, I got a full article about girls and games, and the treatment they receive.

Now, I only play PC games online, never console, and I usually have voice comms off, so the only girls I'll talk to in a game over mic are ones I've known for and we're in a Teamspeak channel with other people who we all know. Because of that, I don't hear this trash that often. Maybe it's also because of the games I play these days, I don't know.

But anyway, the article pointed out some interesting stuff(even if some of it is quite badly written and also has some terrible points - e.g. "it's out game not yours" which just reeks of elitism built up from "I played games in the 70s so **** you" to me) which is definitely applicable to a gaming network like GON with all of its servers and the people it caters to.

Thoughts? Also works well to swap out 'girls' for any other minority/discriminated group you can think of.

EDIT: This video is attached in the comments lolo.

[Mekon]

Agree with the vast majority of what he wrote... except the online anonymity thing. Don't get me wrong - I can see how forcing everyone to own up to everything they do will result in better behaviour.

Except that in real life, your words aren't recorded for perpetuity, for the perusal of future employers/children/etc. Who hasn't posted something foolish while drunk, over tired or just plain cranky? I do it all the bloody time...

Added to which, many gamers are not yet adults and are entitled to the protection that an online handle gives them.

Other than that, it's a great article.

[Ralph Wiggum]

Nice to see he also challenged the sad and **** rebuttals the culprits come up with to try and justify their behaviour.

The emerging generation of boys and "men" who casually refer to women as "****" is pretty sad too .

[Scarecrow]

The emerging generation of boys and "men" who casually refer to women as "****" is pretty sad too .

Definitely my most hated word.

Added to which, many gamers are not yet adults and are entitled to the protection that an online handle gives them.

Yeah, that's what I meant by that elitist attitude showing through.

[Dinwiddie]

There was an article in the Herald a couple of Saturdays back on the topic. The most surprising part was about a pro
girl gamer who even got harassed (sexual of course) by her coach of all people. Some people just got no class.
Ah well! The world is full of infantile types and while the girls are an easier target the boys get pretty sick of it too.

The emerging generation of boys and "men" who casually refer to women as "****" is pretty sad too .

A Yankee hip-hop rapper DUDE import. Of course we were never too concerned about calling a man a **** though.
Pretty similar level of insult I reckon.
And both are less offensive than the other traditional Ozzy favorite expletive.

[PirateEggs]

A Yankee hip-hop rapper DUDE import. Of course we were never too concerned about calling a man a **** though.

I am a ****. What of it?

There are mute / block / ignore buttons for a reason. Which people seem to forget about. If you're female the insults / abuse gets thrown at you, if you're male they get thrown generally at your mother. I don't give a **** if people are going to abuse me, but don't abuse my family, ever, because it won't end well for you.
There is always something that people will find different about you to pick on to then justify themselves against abusing that trait. I'd love to see someone scream; "Make me a sandwich b...", or something of the likes in the real word, it wouldn't end well for them. Simply how eThugs roll, until you find their personal information because they suck at ePrivacy and you start telling everyone their real name. They shut up pretty quickly, generally.

Now, in-case my words get twisted; I do not condone this ****, that's why I gave my Xbox to my brother. Too many children with no respect for anyone, there's only a certain amount of times you can 'hit someone' before it gets monotonous. ]

Do any of you know why the "Game experience may change during online play." is there? These man-children is the exact reason why.

[Bek]

Despite having a name that could be interpreted as a female one (Bec is for rebecca damnit), I haven't really come across much misogyny when playing online. Occasionally in games with a derpy playerbase like M&B warband I'll be called a **** (By randoms, not regulars) or something if I piss someone off, and I do see some hate directed towards (actual) female players, however I couldn't really say how much of this is just because they're a woman.

You could always do a practical experiment, change your name to something feminine, change your avatar, play a few rounds of whatever and screenshot the results (assuming you remain passive and don't instigate an argument).

Another interesting (and slightly off topic) point I came across online was when someone on the DXHR forums said (in reference to a player who had killed a female NPC in the storyline) "That is just so wrong. How can you kill women? children too?" My point was "What makes killing a man worse than killing a woman?" Is that sexists against men by saying we're not worth as much, sexist against women for suggesting they're weak, or something in between?

[steve_rogers42]

yea i aint gonna whiteknight, but i cant stand guys who cant come to grips with girl gamers being better than them, and people who are racist on servers. Apart from that i tend to leave servers or quit the game entirely if someones handle or avatar is in some way related to Nazis....

Now, I only play PC games online, never console, and I usually have voice comms off, so the only girls I'll talk to in a game over mic are ones I've known for and we're in a Teamspeak channel with other people who we all know. Because of that, I don't hear this trash that often. Maybe it's also because of the games I play these days, I don't know.

To this day one of the best CoD:W@W players i have come to respect and know is a female gamer. i only found out by her revealing herself, which kinda surprised me, but i understand it well enough since half the servers where we would cross bullets would be full of these 'boyz2men'. Some of my mates at times, have made me quit games, and lans due to their attitude, personally i love it that my GF gets on and has a hit, i wish she would more often, but i tire faster than she does at the abuse she cop's when using voice with rando's.

[Matty]

Know quite a few girls that game, haven't seen any more harassment directed at them then any other person would get. While I agree that people shouldn't act like dicks and we should probably find someway to stop it, no real special treatment is happening here. This happens to everyone.

[Ralph Wiggum]

The emerging generation of boys and "men" who casually refer to women as "****" is pretty sad too .

A Yankee hip-hop rapper DUDE import. Of course we were never too concerned about calling a man a **** though.
Pretty similar level of insult I reckon.
And both are less offensive than the other traditional Ozzy favorite expletive.

Perhaps I need to clarify...when I say casually, I mean they refer to women in general as ****, even when not 'intending' to insult them. As if the word woman/girl/female in their vocabulary has been replaced with ****. I've seen it very occasionally in these forums but I still shake my head. If a female started calling guys **** as a replacement for guy/men/male then I would also consider something is very wrong.

There are mute / block / ignore buttons for a reason. Which people seem to forget about. If you're female the insults / abuse gets thrown at you, if you're male they get thrown generally at your mother. I don't give a **** if people are going to abuse me, but don't abuse my family, ever, because it won't end well for you.

Part of the article discusses how poor attitudes to females in games/on the internet is reflected into poor attitudes and social interaction to females in the real world. Having read a LOT of psychological reports on internet sex predators and trolls, I have definitely found this to be the case. Ultimately if it's not acceptable in the real world, it shouldn't be acceptable on the internet.

IMO muting is the easy way out. If the internet community rallied and showed this person that his attitudes are wrong, hopefully (and I emphasise hopefully) and better example will follow.

[Capt.no0b]

This is actually quite interesting. Part of my Masters research looks at the negative effects of ICT development and I never thought that this could be part of it, but it's quite huge. It shows that the is still a lot of gender inequality and still a lot of people out there that behave like spoiled children (although some of them ARE too) that insist that hurling abuse is the correct way to behave.

But I think one question is "can you alter the persona that these people adopt when they're online?" or "are these people just a**holes all the time?". I don't think respectable online gamers can change the ways these people think. They need to want to change themselves but they're quite happy abusing and blaming others when things go wrong. Muting is the easiest option IMO. Then when nobody is listening, they might go away.

[Dinwiddie]

Perhaps I need to clarify...when I say casually, I mean they refer to women in general as ****, even when not 'intending' to insult them.

Yes, I understand what you are saying, but it remains that the word **** is used similarly. It tends to be a throwaway line here in Oz whereas, in the US for example, it is not used so loosely, and that other word most hated by women is used FAR less over there than here. On the other hand in the US MF'er (and more so in recent times here) is a throwaway line, and has been for many years.
It's a context thing. Not to say that mindless use of expletives is a good thing, but the real issue is intent.

PirateEggs brings up the point that **** also has negative connotations toward women (as are so many expletives), but when used as loosely as it is here in Oz people tend to forget the proper definition, as is the case with MF'er, or just simply F, in the US, (and here). I here a lot more women using F in recent times here in Oz too.

[Scarecrow]

I did actually play with the handle Serena for awhile, but that was on BF1942 in a well established community where it wouldn't be tolerated.

[Wolfstar90]

I did actually play with the handle Serena for awhile, but that was on BF1942 in a well established community where it wouldn't be tolerated.

Were you playing with the same people I was in 1942? BA and DHS were some of the most racist, sexist and generally abusive assholes I've ever met, but **** they were funny. At times it was difficult to play a serious match with some of the stuff they'd say, I definitely miss that community, it kept me playing for years. It was all in good spirit though and mostly in private TS, although occasionally in chat. Text is easier to ignore than someone yelling in your ear though. As a rule I turn off ingame voice chat. Too many people abuse it. If I want to voice chat, it'll be over Skype/TS/Vent etc. People tend to get annoyed when they're abusing me over voice chat and I don't respond.

That video was quite interesting. That dude was a complete douche, hope he has his rank ruined by people who are 'cheating'.

[jmcev]

i feel that this article portrays the older generations better than they deserve to be. some of the worst insults ive receive while gaming have been from these 'men.' in terms of sexism, il give credit where credit is due, the current generation is shocking for demeaning females (myself included) and older generations at least hold back from the vulgar language towards women.

but i feel that the anonymity of the internet is the only thing really allowing this wanker in the video to express himself in that way. im almost 100% sure that if it was someone named 'guygamer95,' he would insult the person the exact same way as he did this poor girl, except with little or young **** instead of ****.

i could elaborate more but its late and im tired.