Terran Tips

Terran Tips

Unread postby Shinanigans » 7 Aug 10, 7:56 pm

Halp. I played SC1 a handful of times so naturally i had NFI what i was doing in SC2. I've played a tonne of Terran games but still horrible at it. So looking for some times on Terran vs X.

What's good against air?
What's good against heavy ground?
What's good against light ground?

My build process generally goes:
    SCV -> 11
    Support
    Barracks
    Pump marines
    Then start building buildings that let me level up (armour/weapons, etc)
    Continue pumping marines, marauders
    Build thors
    Get raped.

I'm very much a late bloomer with RTS which is why i'm getting thoroughly raped in this game, whereas it worked for C&C.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Maxpayne5th » 7 Aug 10, 8:32 pm

Woah slow down there cowboy. I think your jumping too far ahead.

Could you upload a replay for me? Just upload to HERE and put a download link in?

In Windows 7 you can find them at: C:\Users\[Username]\Documents\StarCraft II\Accounts\[Account Number]\6-S2-1-29002\Replays\Unsaved (Or Saved, if you actually saved them.)

Just quickly though, how many workers do you build for your main? It sounds like your stopping at 11 (I hope not) and your trying to tech up too fast.

While your finding the replay for me, have a read of this, its very true on alot of levels.

This is not about a particular race, this is just general (overall) tips no matter what race you play. I'm also not going to go into anything Single Player, as the Single Player is about challenges against a dumb AI and throwing it all at you, this is for the Multiplayer, where the game is balanced to a T.

Starcraft II hints & Tips

Welcome to Starcraft II.

You've probably jumped into your first game of Multiplayer SCII goodness, but wondered a couple of things:

"Who should I play as?"
"How should I start out?"
"Do I mass build, or tech up?"
"Where is my opponent?"
"How do I play?" (Yes, don't laugh. At first, this sounds like a stupid question, but in actuality, when people have lost like 5 games in a row, they can't help but feel they're missing something. So it begs the question.)

What I'm gonna tell you guys is some basics. This isn't a "Left click on a building to select it" kind of guide, you do have tutorials in game for that. This is for that one step further. Still beginner, but you know how to control yourself. Now you need to learn about the game.

Starcraft II is an RTS, but its a very simple RTS, with many intricacies. Simple, intricate? Oxymoron much? But its true. Its very easy to pick up, but hard to master. The game is split up with 3 factions, the gutsy Terran, the honorable Protoss, and the ghoulish Zerg. All 3 are completely different in their playstyle, but all balanced so that one is not overpowered over another.

Now onto the actual tips. Remember these are not specific to any race, this is to all. So don't expect any build orders or when to push out with your zerglings.

Main Base

You start at out at one of 2/4/6/8 starting locations with a Command Centre/Nexus/Hatchery and 6 harvesters. (SCVs/Probes/Drones) When you start you want to send all of them to mining. Unlike in SC:BW, SCII has really good AI pathing, allowing you to send your workers all at once to a mineral and they will mine the ones that are free. What you can also do is set a rally point to your minerals, and any newly made harvesters will automatically either mine minerals, or collect Vespene Gas. This is important, your 2 most important things are your harvesters and your resources. Without resources, you can't build or train. Without harvesters, you can't collect resources. So no harvesters mean now resources, which means no units. So Protip One:

1. Protect your Harvesters.

I'm not saying you should have all your untis at the mineral line, that would be foolish, but have somethng close by, or some static defenses. If they break through, don't let your harvesters take punishment, run them out of there, preferably to your army.

Speaking of harvesters, your really need a lot of harvesters to collect resources effectively. The normal amount of workers that the pros use is 3 to each resource. There are 8 Mineral Patches and 2 Vespene Gysers at each base. So to effectively gather resources, you need lots of harvesters. Protip Two:

2. Keep building harvesters

Seriously. Don't stop making em. There's nothing wrong with making another probe, unless you've got something like 4 probes on the one mineral line, then you should probably move them to another expansion. Or get some of them to start building buildings.

Economy/Macro

At first, your instantly assume Starcraft with Micromanagement. When your in Bronze League, don't worry about Micro. Seriously, get to work on your Macro. What is Macro? Basically its building your economy to build a base and make units. With bad Macro, you will not be able to make the units you want. So lets start with the first tip.

3. Don't get supply blocked

Except for right at the start (before your first supply building [Supply Depot/Pylon/Overlord]) you should never be supply blocked, unless the enemy forced you to be. If you supply blocked yourself, your going to be at a major disadvantage. You should always have some supply left over. Early on, it would be wise to get a few extra supply, just so you don't get supply blocked at the wrong time. Having supply (Unless your maxed out at 200/200) is essential.

If your doing the first part right, and building more harvesters, you should have a good economy. With that you should have many minerals. So, what should you do? Stockpile? or Spend? Unless your saving for an expansion:

4. SPEND SPEND SPEND!!!!

Don't, for the love of god, stockpile. Spend your dough on units, buildings, expansions, supply, etc. Don't ever just let it sit there. Gas is OK, as it may not get spent as much, but if you have over 400 minerals, and its doing nothing, your doing it wrong. Put out some more Zealots/Marines/Zerglings. Build more harvesters. Make more buildings. Do something!

Units and Attacking

So you've built some attacking units. Maybe you've built some marines. Pretty cool, huh? Well now you think your ready to attack. But are you?

5. Scout! Scout! Scout!

No, I'm not talking about calling out for some Bonk! Fizzy Drink, I'm talking about sending something to see what the other guy has got. If he has Roaches, and you have Marines, your toast. if you have Marauders, but he went Void Rays, what are they gonna do? They can't shoot air! This brings me to the next tip:

6. Learn the counters

Once you see what he has, you can counter it with other units by tech switching... but only if you know what counters what. For example, Marauders are a good counter Roaches, while Mutalisks are good counters to Marauders. If you both scout and know the counters, when you see the enemy, you'll know what to start building right away. There are many different things to scout with like harvesters, Overlords for the Zerg, Observers for the Protoss, Orbital Scans for the Terran, and many other creative ways.

Extras

So you finished your game, but your not sure what went wrong. Hmm...

7. Check the replays

You can go back and see what you did wrong, or what your opponent did right. Maybe he tried a good start on you, maybe he scouted you and knew when to attack. Maybe he just scouted you and made hard counters. 90% of the time when you lose, it was something you did. Not him. So look back at what you did wrong, and try to fix it for the next game. If you still can't figure it out, try this:

8. Watch Pro Replays

Seriously, watching a bunch of pro games is great. TLO, Whitera, Artosis, IdrA, and many more know how to play the game real well. Watch some replays from them and see how they do it. The best 2 channels (IMO) are the HDStarcraft and HuskyStarcraft Channels on Youtube. Go check em out and enjoy some of these things, and learn a thing or 2.

Hopefully this all helps for you.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Maxpayne5th » 7 Aug 10, 8:42 pm

Also i thought I'd chuck out my Terran build order.

Any blanks are SCVs to the mineral line.

9/11 - SCV to make Supply Depot at choke.
11/19 - Barracks
14 or 15/19 - Orbital Command and 2nd Supply Depot to finish the wall. In the same time, make a refinery.
16/19 - Marine
18/19 - Marine
20/27 - Barracks with Tech Lab

At this point, I've scouted the guy with one of my SCVs, and seen what he's going for. If he's rushing, I go an MM build. If he's holding back, I go for a MMM Dropship Build, where I get 8 Marines, 4 marauders, and get 2 medivacs, and destroy his mineral line. If he's teching, I push with what I got.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Novocaine » 7 Aug 10, 8:45 pm

What's good against air?
What's good against heavy ground?
What's good against light ground?


There's no real straight and simple answer for that one. Every unit can counter 2-3 types of units while at the same time is vulnerable to 2-3 types of units.

Take a look through here, it's daunting at first but after a while you will get used to what counters what.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Shinanigans » 7 Aug 10, 9:15 pm

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/5261 ... high-orbit

Most recent game.
Don't understand how they're getting so far ahead in both unit count and unit advancement.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Maxpayne5th » 7 Aug 10, 10:03 pm

Shinanigans wrote:http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/52618-2v2-terran-protoss-high-orbit

Most recent game.
Don't understand how they're getting so far ahead in both unit count and unit advancement.


Hoo boy. Ok. Now this is gonna be harsh, but constructive.

Ok. Your problems:

1. NOT ENOUGH HARVESTERS!

Seriously. The WHOLE match you were at least 7 harvesters behind. 7! I noticed right at the start, just as you got to 9 supply, you stopped building workers. DON'T STOP BUILDING WORKERS! Saturate that to the max! You should have 30 workers in your main, 24 for the minerals, 6 for the gas. And Hold 2 for building. Thats 32 SCVs!

2. You didn't have a clear plan.

Ok, so you went for a Rax, then an engineering bay, and then a Factory into Thors. I understand you love Thors, but going for a quick Thor build (Even though it wasn't that quick) is a bad idea unless you know what your doing. You just wanted Thors. You didn't know how you were going to do it, just get there. Like a Greyhound chasing the rabbit, your not looking at whats infront of you, only whats in your sights. In the meantime, some key, critical errors popped up.

3. No scouting.

It was a 2v2 and neither of you scouted. You would've seen Void rays coming, and gone and built mass Marines with Stimpacks, and some Vikings. But until they hit you, you had no idea. Scout Scout Scout!

4. Teching too hard.

Like I said in my small guide, when to tech is tough, but you were going for it WAYYYYYY to early. Ground Weps 1 should be a mid game thing when you hit the 20 min mark. Besides, you were going Thors weren't you? Wouldn't it have been better to upgrade your Thor? You probably should've gone the MM build, maybe even some Medivacs.

5. Not paying attention to your main base.

Agreed, its hard paying attention to your troops, and your main base. But your SCVs were getting murdered, and you did nothing. You could've at least grabbed that Seige tank and started shooting at them. Instead, the other player grabbed his Stalkers and did it for you.

Maybe 6. No block on your choke.

See right at the start, your friend pinged the map at the ramp of your base? He was trying to say "Block it off". If they had rushed early with Zealots, you would've been toast. In the end it didn't matter, but get into the habit of blockign off your choke.

Thats all I can really say. If you'd like, add me to your friends list, and we'll do some 2v2 VS AI just so you can get your strat down pat.

i think the bigger problem is your fascination with Thors. Yes they're tech 3, but they aren't that awesome. They're not Rambo, so don't treat em as such.

Sorry if I came off a bit strong, but I really needed to tell you these things. Once you've fixed this, you should be well on your way out of Bronze, and onto bigger and better things.

Also, here is an upload of a ladder match I played. The other guy isn't the best, but the end result isn't what i wanted to show you, what I wanted to show you is the build.

Its not perfect, but you'll see some MAJOR differences between this and your replay.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/5262 ... pes-of-war
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Marius » 8 Aug 10, 6:41 pm

You need to learn to specialise. Terrans can either be infantry, mech or air. Mixing Thors and marines won't work.

If you want thors for mech, then you have to transition from marines for early defense into hellhounds and siege tanks ASAP. If you want to stick with marines, you need to transition to marines, marauders and medivacs.

I do think it is just the basics you need to improve though. Basics like economy come before race strats. If you want a really good, and easy to understand guide on how to play by a top player, watch http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/3732340/
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby SilverforceX » 12 Aug 10, 2:02 pm

Terran vs Protoss, how to easy win steamroll everybody until high diamond.

9 - Supply
11 - Barracks
13 - Refinery (make sure you put 3 scvs to harvest)
14 - OC Get Mules asap

When barracks finishes, get a tech lab asap. When done, get a marauder, rally it to the enemy base, research conc shell as you start building the marauder. If its a 1v1 map, this is easy, if its 2v2 map, get an scv to scout to find them prior to all this.

Bring the marauder (keep making more marauders, rally to your enemy base) into protoss base. Pretty much all protoss has at this point is 1 zealot, and they may or may not even started building a stalker (usually the cybernetics core hasnt even finished so they cant get a stalker up). With conc shell, just kite the zealot to death without being hit, park the marauder near the gateway to kill the stalker as it pops out (marauder destroys stalker 1v1, with slow shells, it makes zealots a joke). By now your 2nd marauder should have arrived with the 3rd on the way etc. You won, gg.

There's only 1 way for protoss to have a chance at stopping this early marauder with shell upgrade and thats to sacrifice a few probes to fight. Which puts you ahead.

This build is pretty much guaranteed win vs protoss in 1v1 maps until you reach very high diamond levels where ppl can micro a few probes and the zealot to fend it off.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby MCUD » 12 Aug 10, 2:31 pm

So far I've found enemy air unit's my biggest bane as Terran. Are Terran naturally weak at countering air? Or is there something I'm missing, it seems marines + vikings are the only real options, and aren't effective the moment they have any reasonable air force.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Fireslide » 12 Aug 10, 3:05 pm

If you're terran vs protoss, tech up reapers quickly and use them to bypass the main chokepoint into their base and destroy their econmoy, reapers 2/3 shot probes and unless the protoss has a stalker out, you can kite zealots by ledge hopping until they research charge. Killing 5 or 6 probes early costs enemy about 300 minerals, which usually covers the cost of your economic hit for going early reapers.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby SilverforceX » 12 Aug 10, 6:11 pm

MCUD wrote:So far I've found enemy air unit's my biggest bane as Terran. Are Terran naturally weak at countering air? Or is there something I'm missing, it seems marines + vikings are the only real options, and aren't effective the moment they have any reasonable air force.


Terran has the strongest anti-air, and also the strongest air fleet.

Vikings dominate or hold their own vs everything, are fast to produce with reactors and are cheap. BCs are just nasty with yamato. Void Rays and Corruptors are meant to counter BCs, but with yamato, they have no chance.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby MrGood » 13 Aug 10, 3:38 am

SilverforceX wrote:
MCUD wrote:So far I've found enemy air unit's my biggest bane as Terran. Are Terran naturally weak at countering air? Or is there something I'm missing, it seems marines + vikings are the only real options, and aren't effective the moment they have any reasonable air force.


Terran has the strongest anti-air, and also the strongest air fleet.

Vikings dominate or hold their own vs everything, are fast to produce with reactors and are cheap. BCs are just nasty with yamato. Void Rays and Corruptors are meant to counter BCs, but with yamato, they have no chance.


If you've teched to BCs, then it's pretty easy for a toss to quicktech switch to High Temp and just feedback your BC's into oblivion. put them with a few blink stalks to dodge the canon... but I take your point.

Terran has very good anti air, use vikings well, they are quite a versatile unit but do require quite a bit of management. Their long range makes them very useful.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby awaisroxs » 16 Aug 10, 10:07 pm

SilverforceX wrote:Terran vs Protoss, how to easy win steamroll everybody until high diamond.

9 - Supply
11 - Barracks
13 - Refinery (make sure you put 3 scvs to harvest)
14 - OC Get Mules asap



I go

10 - supply
11 - barracks (scout with scv)
11 - refinery
15 - barracks
Push out and win the game...
Keep ur weak units behind =D I dont think i have had anyone beat me against this strategy yet. From time to time Macro is also good when you are way ahead of ur enemy and he/she are teching and you grab like 10 bases.
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Batesy » 16 Aug 10, 10:57 pm

Supply
Barracks > tech
Armory
Factory, switch with barracks
THORS :D
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Re: Terran Tips

Unread postby Maxpayne5th » 17 Aug 10, 6:38 am

Batesy wrote:Supply
Barracks > tech
Armory
Factory, switch with barracks
THORS :D


Against Protoss, sure. But if you play against Zerg (And maybe terran) and in the early stages, he may have gone mass lings, then your thors are screwed.
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