D20: Ownership

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D20: Ownership

Unread postby News Portal » 12 Mar 12, 2:36 pm

With the news going around that there's a petition being circulated by angry fans to change the ending of [app=7843]Mass Effect 3[/app], Daniel Wilks white-hot-rage-o-meter has exploded completely.

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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Markavian » 12 Mar 12, 2:42 pm

The ending to ME3 was fine, felt a sense of closure on finishing it, the ending to FF XIII-2 however left me stunned.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby a3gis » 12 Mar 12, 2:48 pm

Markavian wrote:The ending to ME3 was fine, felt a sense of closure on finishing it, the ending to FF XIII-2 however left me stunned.


I think that's a cultural thing - so few anime shows/movies have what you'd call a decent ending in the west. (I will admit, given your avatar, that Gurren Lagann had an excellent ending :P )
Last edited by a3gis on 12 Mar 12, 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Tas » 12 Mar 12, 2:48 pm

He makes a fair point, todays youngsters are self entitled whinging children. Screw em, if they dont like the game dont play or dont buy it it really is that simple.

I refuse to play EA games myself so I never bought BF3 seems quite easy to understand to me.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Yurtles » 12 Mar 12, 2:54 pm

Is the article spoiler free? I am afeared to read it.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Marius » 12 Mar 12, 2:56 pm

Article is spoiler free, yes.

It's more the way the Mass Effect games have been designed, and how ME3 changed this.

ME1 and ME2 were, I thought, very clear cut - paragon or renegade. ME3 skirts closer to The Witcher, where things you thought were good turn out to be bad.

And it annoys some people that they don't get angelic outcomes.

I personally don't care. As I've said elsewhere, my Femshep is a mix of paragon and renegade.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Irritus » 12 Mar 12, 2:57 pm

It's not really as simple as the article likes to make it sound. In a roleplaying game like this, every time you make a choice, your putting in your own brushstrokes. At that point it's not just bioware's work of art, part of it is -your's-. To say it's their's and only their's is all well and good in a totally linear storytelling format, like a book or movie (or some games), where you have no input. But particular rpgs, like mass effect, like to tout about giving the player a choice, shape the universe as you want, play how you want, but then to turn around and say "this is how it ends, or choose from these equally unappealing options". It's understandable now some would see it as a slap in the face. It's not a painting, and it's not a sculpture, if gaming is art, then a nonlinear rpg is colaborative art, and there has to be allowance for different styles in that. I don't really feel like ME3's ending gave much room for that.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Irritus » 12 Mar 12, 3:05 pm

Possible spoiler.

Hidden: show
More specifically to ME3. I think part of the problem is, for me at least, Mass Effect has largely been Shepherd's story, not so much the universe as a whole. Of the choices of ending in ME3, as far as the universe is concerned, it wasn't great imo, but the choices mattered and they were varied (although, where did that middle opton come from?). In shepherd's regard however, it didn't really matter what you did, the results were very similar, and the only minor difference, really felt like a token gesture.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Bluefire » 12 Mar 12, 3:18 pm

Just like to point out that you DONT OWN a copy of ME3 you have hired a licence to use it which can be revoked any time ea choose :P
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Angeredsoul » 12 Mar 12, 3:26 pm

should be 4th ending, preferably with more cowbell.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Marius » 12 Mar 12, 3:26 pm

Bluefire wrote:Just like to point out that you DONT OWN a copy of ME3 you have hired a licence to use it which can be revoked any time ea choose :P

But ownership of your character's story is a different thing entirely.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby vcatkiller » 12 Mar 12, 3:32 pm

Wait, I'm pretty sure Bioware came out and predicted this.

http://games.on.net/article/14814/Mass_ ... _You_Angry

Yep. Don't really have much intention (atm) of getting the game but people being disappointed at an ending even the creators said would disappoint people isn't much of a shock. Still, creating a petition and expecting Bioware to change it because of this is a little....silly. To say the least. I don't expect Bioware to do anything, in fact I hope they don't.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Bluefire » 12 Mar 12, 3:34 pm

Comment was directed towards the story not any particular post afterwards.

"You may own a copy of the product of BioWare's endeavours and hold it close to your heart, but it will always remain their game."

You do NOT own a copy of the product.

No objection to owning save files but they arent much good if you dont own a game to use them in ;)
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Lord_Apophis » 12 Mar 12, 3:48 pm

Bluefire wrote:You do NOT own a copy of the product.

No objection to owning save files but they arent much good if you dont own a game to use them in ;)


I disagree. Regardless of what EA's Eula may say... Such things cannot override consumer protection laws.

We didn't agree to a binding contract to rent the came nor do we pay for periodical payments to continue playing it, so common sense dictates that we own the product that we purchased. - Which is what would hold up in court.

EA cannot enter my home and take my Discs away because they "say" they own it and not me.

The Eula means bugger all, no one ever reads it, it's just something EA can use as extra ammunition in-case something goes wrong.
I can write a Eula that upon payment to EA for a game; that I now own it and it would have as much binding as EA's.
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Re: D20: Ownership

Unread postby Mekon » 12 Mar 12, 4:12 pm

Lord_Apophis wrote:We didn't agree to a binding contract to rent the came nor do we pay for periodical payments to continue playing it, so common sense dictates that we own the product that we purchased. - Which is what would hold up in court.

I'd hate for you to be disappointed if you ever have your day in court... you're wrong. You own a license and some disks.

Lord_Apophis wrote:I can write a Eula that upon payment to EA for a game; that I now own it and it would have as much binding as EA's.

You be trippin'... you can't write an "End User" license agreement for yourself. You are the end user.

EULA's (generally) cannot override consumer rights, at least in this country. However... just what rights you have as a consumer of a software license has yet to be tested in court.
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